1 Pages
1
 
500 low comp started by DougMN
October 20th 2009 at 7:57 PM
 
DougMN
Starting Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
24 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: January 2nd 2004
Location: Stillwater, MN, USA
 
 
I bought a 1997 classic, the carbs had just been cleaned. With 285 miles on it. It was never as fast as my sons 1996 classic. Keep getting slower, a compression test and a look in the exhaust port showed burnt pistons. Honed the cylinders and put in SPI pistons and rings. Ran good, 85 mph but over the next 60 miles it started to slow down and started hard. Compression test 98 lbs.in both cylinders. Are these SPIs known as good or bad. What other rings will work on SPI pistons. What type of rings are SPI? Thanks.




Rating:
0
 
 
 
Site Supporter
Group: Site Supporters
 
 
 
October 21st 2009 at 2:52 PM  [ Modified October 21st 2009 at 2:53 PM ]
 
mrholmquist
Junior Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
500 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: December 15th 2003
Location: cobourg, on, Canada
 
 
Quote originally posted by DougMN

I bought a 1997 classic, the carbs had just been cleaned. With 285 miles on it. It was never as fast as my sons 1996 classic. Keep getting slower, a compression test and a look in the exhaust port showed burnt pistons. Honed the cylinders and put in SPI pistons and rings. Ran good, 85 mph but over the next 60 miles it started to slow down and started hard. Compression test 98 lbs.in both cylinders. Are these SPIs known as good or bad. What other rings will work on SPI pistons. What type of rings are SPI? Thanks.


You cant just replace burnt pistons and expect everything to be ok unless you repair the reason they burnt in the first place. If you dont correct the cause of the problem it will just happen again. The most common cause for a piston to overheat is a lean mixture ie too much air in the fuel charge. This can be caused by dirty or improperly jetted carbs which dont supply enough fuel for the engine. A lean mixture can also be caused by air leaks into the crankcase, the extra air dilutes and leans the fuel mixture with fresh air. Air leaks are common when seals and gaskets fail, especially crank seals. The carb boots where they attach to the engine are also known to crack and tear causing air leaks. Whenever pistons are melted you need to dissassemble the engine completely and replace the crank seals and all other seals and gaskets to eleminate any air leaks. As well as check and repair any other cause of lean mixtures.

I've used SPI pistons with no issues.




Rating:
0
 
October 21st 2009 at 3:36 PM
 
slamdry
President of the EFP/BRP/SLEDCRUSHER fan club!!
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
2397 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: February 17th 2007
Location: Cohoes, NY, USA
Current Sled: 02 RMK 600 + 97 xc 600
2008-2009 Miles: 910
 
 
a easy way to check for air leak is get it running and spray carb cleaner on the intake boos and then around the crank seals and see if the rpm's increase.

Like stated above without fixing the issue for a meltdown it will just keep happening..

Did you take it apart again?? what do the pistons look like this time??



Quote originally posted by BRP-4-LIFE
If I don't keep this sled for the whole season, I promise to never sign on to Snowmobile Fanatics again.

Rating:
0
 
October 21st 2009 at 4:40 PM
 
polaris1man
Average Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
738 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: December 22nd 2007
Location: Nashwauk, Minnesota, USA
Current Sled: Polaris SKS700
2008-2009 Miles: not many
 
 
Quote originally posted by DougMN

I bought a 1997 classic, the carbs had just been cleaned. With 285 miles on it. It was never as fast as my sons 1996 classic. Keep getting slower, a compression test and a look in the exhaust port showed burnt pistons. Honed the cylinders and put in SPI pistons and rings. Ran good, 85 mph but over the next 60 miles it started to slow down and started hard. Compression test 98 lbs.in both cylinders. Are these SPIs known as good or bad. What other rings will work on SPI pistons. What type of rings are SPI? Thanks.


60 miles and you burnt a second set of pistons/rings? Sounds like the carbs are jetted too lean. Is there any color on the top of the pistons, or is the plug have a silver coating to it? Do you have like a "football" indent on the top of the pistons?



Three-1999 Polaris SKS700's
2000 Polaris SKS700
2000 Polaris Ranger 6x6
2007 Polaris Sportsman 800 EFI X2
2000 Yamaha YZ 250
1996 Yamaha WR250

Rating:
0
 
October 21st 2009 at 9:11 PM
 
DougMN
Starting Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
24 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: January 2nd 2004
Location: Stillwater, MN, USA
 
 
The assumptions that the pistons are burnt are false. I looked in the exhaust ports tonight and they look ok. Back to my original question what kind of rings do SPIs come with and what else will fit.




Rating:
0
 
October 23rd 2009 at 7:54 AM
 
polaris1man
Average Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
738 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: December 22nd 2007
Location: Nashwauk, Minnesota, USA
Current Sled: Polaris SKS700
2008-2009 Miles: not many
 
 
SPI has their own rings, but if pistons and rings are ok, did you have the cylinders measured to make sure a stock set up is with in tolerances?



Three-1999 Polaris SKS700's
2000 Polaris SKS700
2000 Polaris Ranger 6x6
2007 Polaris Sportsman 800 EFI X2
2000 Yamaha YZ 250
1996 Yamaha WR250

Rating:
0
 
October 23rd 2009 at 8:34 AM
 
Redd
New Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
71 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: October 11th 2009
Location: Rosville, Michigan, USA
Current Sled: 2005 Fusion 900
 
 
Did you check the cyl.'s to make sure they are not "egg shaped" or worn? If you honed them you took something off and you could loose compression from blow by.
Melting down is a lean or air leak, that's where I would check. Intake boots if even cracked a little should be replaced imo, my 900 has some cacks in them and don't leak, but today I'm takeing them off to replace some when out in the trails
I don't have to find out that 1 crack is now a split!



He who dies with the most toys wins!

Rating:
0
 
October 23rd 2009 at 9:28 AM
 
Ugly_old_Poo_kid
techno-bumpkin
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
1074 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: March 18th 2007
Location: Walworth, NY, USA
Current Sled: 05 Edge & Frankenstorm II
2008-2009 Miles: 165
 
 
I've never heard of SPI pistons or rings going bad in 60 miles, unless there's another problem...

You should stop looking for band-aids, and find the problem.



95 - Storm 800 - Modded - AKA: FrankenStorm - Totalled near 100mph at Tug Hill!
96 - XLT/SP with Storm 800 trip/trip and now EFI - FrankenStorm II lives...
95 - RXL -- Sale Pending --
05 - Edge 800 long track - Stayin' stock for now..
---------------------------------------------
It made me more compassionate, more empathetic, more nurturing...
I FEEL LIKE I'M TRAPPED IN MY OWN WORST NIGHTMARE!!!

Rating:
0
 
October 23rd 2009 at 10:03 AM
 
bigwedgies
Average Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
611 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 2nd 2006
Location: lake city, pennsylvania
 
 
yeah it says you honed the cylinders but how were the tolerances? if you burned a piston you definately had a serious problem that needed attention before reasembling. SPI pistons are excellent pistons.




Rating:
0
 
October 23rd 2009 at 4:06 PM  [ Modified October 23rd 2009 at 4:14 PM ]
 
mrholmquist
Junior Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
500 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: December 15th 2003
Location: cobourg, on, Canada
 
 
^^^ x2

the quality of the parts is not your problem. You have overlooked something when you rebuilt the engine.

Like I mentioned in my first post since the pistons were burnt the first time you need to dissassemble the engine completely to replace the seals as well as check and correct all possible causes of air leaks.
Even if your new pistons haven't burnt a second time (yet) without repairing the cause they will eventually.




Rating:
0
 
October 24th 2009 at 8:10 PM  [ Modified October 24th 2009 at 8:12 PM ]
 
500Indy01
Junior Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
172 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 19th 2008
 
 
Quote originally posted by DougMN

I bought a 1997 classic, the carbs had just been cleaned. With 285 miles on it. It was never as fast as my sons 1996 classic. Keep getting slower, a compression test and a look in the exhaust port showed burnt pistons. Honed the cylinders and put in SPI pistons and rings. Ran good, 85 mph but over the next 60 miles it started to slow down and started hard. Compression test 98 lbs.in both cylinders. Are these SPIs known as good or bad. What other rings will work on SPI pistons. What type of rings are SPI? Thanks.



So, lets try to break this down....Your engine performance all of a sudden gets mediocre. An exhaust port and compression test show a drop in compression and burnt pistons. You hone the cylinders and install new SPI pistons and rings. Now you have how much compression after the rebuild? (THIS IS A MISSING LINK...) But you have renewed performance after the rebuild, so we'll figure you have 125 to 140Lbs. of compression after the rebuild just for the sake of conversation. And then after 60 miles the performance drops, after another compression check now you only have 98 lbs. compression (In Both Cylinders).

So, what would make BOTH cylinders lose compression at the same time? Since we have no report on spark plug condition ie. color or if there was debris on the plugs. And a second exhaust port check has not been described in detail. Just a note on exhaust port checks, unless you have a lighted scope to look in through the exhaust port to the intake side or the evidence of failure is on the ex. port side. they're pretty much so inconclusive. Pistons don't always burn on the exhaust side. So, again we go back to the only physical evidence we have given to us, the loss of compression in BOTH cylinders at the same time, and the sled still runs,but is hard to start. The cylinders were honed, were they honed straight?. or was too much material taken off when done?...we don't know. But the chances that both cylinders were equally egg shaped or over honed so that the compression levels were the same in both cylinders ?...LOL...even Pro's aren't that good.
And, if they were that bad when the cylinders were reinstalled, the sled would have never shown a performance increase then a drop off.it would have been horrible to start. And cylinder wear would not happen that fast as to only get 60 miles on it before a noticable drop in performance of the engine.

So, what parts were replaced that could wear or fail that fast and POSSIBLY show an equal drop in compression in both cylinders at the same time? It is something that has not been looked at or been accused as a culprit to this problem.

I would almost bet that if you have an equal pressure drop in both cylinders without any other conflicting evidence here I would have to say it's either a blown head gasket or base gasket at this point. and If you retorque the head and base bolts incorrectly either done out of sequence or improper poundage they're gonna blow. and they will cause a drop in compression in both cylinders, and make the engine hard to start not only because of the drop in pressure, but in most cases it will let water into the cylinder and lower the flamability of the fuel. other evedence of this wich was left out is water droplets on the spark plugs and or back firing when trying to start,another note is that backfiring is also caused by a severe lean condition as well.

I have run SPI's for a long time and never had problems....

Hope this helps either fix or rule out some of your problems....




Rating:
0
 
October 24th 2009 at 9:57 PM
 
mrholmquist
Junior Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
500 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: December 15th 2003
Location: cobourg, on, Canada
 
 
it all depends as we dont know what grit of hone he used either. Also did he wash the cylinders in soap and hot water to remove the grit left after honing ?




Rating:
0
 
October 25th 2009 at 3:21 PM
 
500Indy01
Junior Member
Send this user an email message Send this user a private message View this users gallery View this users blog
172 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 19th 2008
 
 
Quote originally posted by mrholmquist

it all depends as we dont know what grit of hone he used either. Also did he wash the cylinders in soap and hot water to remove the grit left after honing ?




Not enough information i guess to give him a straight answer......lmao




Rating:
0
 
1 Pages
1
0 user(s) are reading this topic (0 Members and 0 Guests)





© 2001-2009 Snowmobile Fanatics. All rights reserved.
  Ads By Outsidehub | Hosted By Wiktel | Donate | Advertise Execution in 0.015625 seconds using 2 queries

Loading...