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91 'Cat EXT El Tigre - no spark~!
started by DaveTV
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August 6th 2005 at 10:16 AM
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DaveTV
Starting Member
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36 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 25th 2004
Location: Braintree, MA
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Hi gang, happy summer  - well I changed my throttle cable last month as one of the carb cables was broken - took the carbs off them and cleaned the bowls, reassembled everything carefully according to my CLYMERS Arctic Cat manual - when I tried to start it a month ago, it wouldn't start and the plugs were soaked so I figured it was flooded - removed the plugs, turned off the gas to let it dry - pulled it over every few days to speed the drying. so this morning I figured I would give it a shot - no go, plugs were wet - so just for the heck of it I got some dry plugs and checked for spark - nuthin! (yes, the key is 'on and the kill switch off) - now this thing ran/had spark before I started the cable job - is there a fuse somewhere, or could I have accidently pulled a wire somewhere that would kill the spark? Any thoughts, ideas or advice appreciated! 
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August 7th 2005 at 3:02 PM
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maniac_psycho_666
Junior Member
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131 Posts 
Group: Members
Member Since: August 1st 2005
Location: Fairview, Alberta, Canada
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One thing to check would be the ground wire. It is usually a black wire with a joining piece, might have been ripped appart but will go right back together. I had the same problem with my sled. One other thing i think might be if it is flooding would be that the cable is to short. Make sure there is some give way in the throttle or else the throttle might be held open a little bit flooding the sled. Hope it helps. 
Nitrous is like a hot girl with a STD, you wanna hit it but your afraid of the consequences!
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August 7th 2005 at 3:24 PM
[ Modified August 7th 2005 at 3:27 PM
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Jorgie
Muskoka Madness
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561 Posts 
Group: Members
Member Since: March 23rd 2004
Location: Muskoka, Ontario, Canada
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It could be your coil...or more likely a Micro-safety switches in your throttle block. Like a throttel position sensor.They are there for when and if a throttle sticks open. You can bypass the sensors and you sled should start up. On my old 99 zr 700 i had a problem with no spark..replaced the coil, stator..tried everything and then found out it was probably just this sensor and could have saved myself alot of money. Hope this helps...Dave.
Unknown.
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August 7th 2005 at 3:27 PM
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Quote Originally posted by DaveTV
Hi gang, happy summer - well I changed my throttle cable last month as one of the carb cables was broken - took the carbs off them and cleaned the bowls, reassembled everything carefully according to my CLYMERS Arctic Cat manual - when I tried to start it a month ago, it wouldn't start and the plugs were soaked so I figured it was flooded - removed the plugs, turned off the gas to let it dry - pulled it over every few days to speed the drying. so this morning I figured I would give it a shot - no go, plugs were wet - so just for the heck of it I got some dry plugs and checked for spark - nuthin! (yes, the key is 'on and the kill switch off) - now this thing ran/had spark before I started the cable job - is there a fuse somewhere, or could I have accidently pulled a wire somewhere that would kill the spark? Any thoughts, ideas or advice appreciated!
i dought there is a fuse unless its an efi or has electric start.check the connections to the cdi box or does this sled have points ? check the connection on the wires going into the magneto. even if the tps wasnt triggerin right. i would think the sled would still start but just not move.i know on my cat motor its all a closed circuit. so if a wire gets unpluged theres no spark.dont forget to check the tether cord wires and the ignition wires pull all the connection apart and reconect to make sure there clean and tight
Error: Gallery file 51690 doesn't exist!
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August 7th 2005 at 11:02 PM
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arcticcatmatt
Spleen Splitter
arcticcatmatt leaving after work for 3 days of shotgun season back home!
Updated Friday at 12:16 PM
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14007 Posts 
Group: Moderators
Member Since: November 25th 2001
Location: Berkshire, NY, USA
Current Sled: 96/97 ZRT 600
2008-2009 Miles: 450
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my bet is coil.. and being how old it is, a local used sled parts yard would probally let you borrow one to test it.. or sell it to you dirt dirt cheap
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August 8th 2005 at 10:20 AM
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Quote Originally posted by Jorgie
It could be your coil...or more likely a Micro-safety switches in your throttle block. Like a throttel position sensor.They are there for when and if a throttle sticks open. You can bypass the sensors and you sled should start up. On my old 99 zr 700 i had a problem with no spark..replaced the coil, stator..tried everything and then found out it was probably just this sensor and could have saved myself alot of money. Hope this helps...Dave.
Doubt there will be a safety switch in the old el tigre, check all the connections, starting with the plug wires and work your way back. Depending on how old those plugs are you may want to change them out. Then you'll want to check coils, by either replacing them or using a known good coil. If the issue is still no resolved, then you'll want to look into a new stator. Although the sled had spark before, doesn't mean the summer heat and humidity hasn't taken it's toll. Good Luck.
Cause I don't give a rats about who took second or 12th for that matter your just the next loser in a long line of many losers.
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August 8th 2005 at 1:52 PM
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anyone here know if this yr @ model sled has electronic ign or does it use points ?
Error: Gallery file 51690 doesn't exist!
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August 8th 2005 at 2:11 PM
[ Modified August 8th 2005 at 2:12 PM
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how much slack is there on the new throttle cable ? make sure there is very little slack. its possible that it has a tss as stated before. and if it has to much slack might cause a no spark situation. a safety feature so that if the sled senses its got any throttle it wont start. make sure your throttle lever has very litle if any slack .i am not sure just specualtion i know cat runs a closed circuit so its very possible. last yr when i put a cat motor in a project the throttle safety switch was very touchy took me some messin to get it all figured out.it can be bi-passed
Error: Gallery file 51690 doesn't exist!
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August 8th 2005 at 2:22 PM
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arcticcatmatt
Spleen Splitter
arcticcatmatt leaving after work for 3 days of shotgun season back home!
Updated Friday at 12:16 PM
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14007 Posts
Group: Moderators
Member Since: November 25th 2001
Location: Berkshire, NY, USA
Current Sled: 96/97 ZRT 600
2008-2009 Miles: 450
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Quote Originally posted by lars
anyone here know if this yr @ model sled has electronic ign or does it use points ?
check www.brownsleisureworld.com their parts system should be able to tell you.
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August 8th 2005 at 2:57 PM
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This sled is a CDI setup.
Cause I don't give a rats about who took second or 12th for that matter your just the next loser in a long line of many losers.
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August 8th 2005 at 5:53 PM
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DaveTV
Starting Member
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36 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 25th 2004
Location: Braintree, MA
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Thanks for all the advice~ According to the owners manual, there is a "throttle monitor switch" which it says "will stop the engine when a loss of return spring force occurs." - So this could be caused by the cable not having enough slack? It would be nice to be able to bypass it just for tuning, and hook it up again before it goes into battle. I just went out to mess with it, and it is extremely humid here at the moment, as the sweat poured down my face I decided to wait for a more comfortable day to mess with it. 
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August 9th 2005 at 11:00 AM
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stormrider62033
wally
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4729 Posts 
Group: Members
Member Since: December 25th 2004
Location: Gillespie, IL, USA
Current Sled: 99xcr 800
2008-2009 Miles: 500
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i would check that out first before going any farther
mid Il alway's waiting for snow,moving north(way north)2001 thundercat 99xcr 800 97SPX ULTRA 96 zrt 600&800,92 doo plusX 92 v max 4 750
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August 9th 2005 at 12:18 PM
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Frosty
Junior Member
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464 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 11th 2004
Location: Michigan, USA
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There definatly is a trottle safty interlock switch on all Arctic Cats since 1973. The first thing to check is that you have the slack adjusted out of the cables.If there is any slack in either cable it will not get spark. Once you have the cables adjusted properly it should have spark. If it still does not have spark afetr you make the adjustment I would bypass the Safty/Kill switch. On this model you will have to close the circut to complete the bypass. If you still have the original tool kit for the sled it came with a bypass plug that you plug into the wiring harness to complete the circut. If it still does not have spark than it's not the cable adjustment it's another problem. If it gets spark after bypassing than it can only be one of two things. A cable adjustmenet or a bad throttle safty/kill switch. If you find that it is the Safty/Kill switch you should change it. Do not ride the sled with it bypassed. It cause the throttle to stick and the engine will not shut down which could be very dangerous.
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August 11th 2005 at 5:55 PM
[ Modified August 11th 2005 at 5:55 PM
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DaveTV
Starting Member
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36 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 25th 2004
Location: Braintree, MA
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I messed with it tonight - removed all slack from cables, adjusted both carbs + slides according to my manual - tried it with throttle closed, half-open, full-open - still no spark! Guess the next step is to get a bypass plug and try that - is this something my 'Cat dealer would stock? THX
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August 11th 2005 at 7:13 PM
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Quote Originally posted by Frosty
There definatly is a trottle safty interlock switch on all Arctic Cats since 1973. The first thing to check is that you have the slack adjusted out of the cables.If there is any slack in either cable it will not get spark. Once you have the cables adjusted properly it should have spark. If it still does not have spark afetr you make the adjustment I would bypass the Safty/Kill switch. On this model you will have to close the circut to complete the bypass. If you still have the original tool kit for the sled it came with a bypass plug that you plug into the wiring harness to complete the circut. If it still does not have spark than it's not the cable adjustment it's another problem. If it gets spark after bypassing than it can only be one of two things. A cable adjustmenet or a bad throttle safty/kill switch. If you find that it is the Safty/Kill switch you should change it. Do not ride the sled with it bypassed. It cause the throttle to stick and the engine will not shut down which could be very dangerous.
Wow, I'm surprised by this.
Anyway, now you you need to look into the coils, stator, CDI. Also you may want to make sure you have continuity from the coils to the plugs. The plug wires are the most moved and abused wires under the hood. Kill switch, easy test is to use a DMM and measur voltage, then read how the switch works in your sled. Did you try different plugs, the ones you may be using may already be fouled, big if, but may be. Coils are the cheapest I'd start there and if that still don't fix her I'd look at bringing the CDI box into the dealer and see if they could do a test on it or something. It has been a humid summer and the moisture could be wreaking havoc with the circuitry. Then if you still don't have spark I'd look into testing the stator. To test the stator you can test the two leads for continuity. If you get a 0 ohms or a number like 10 ohms then the stator is good, if you get a 2,000 ohm reading you have an issue.
Hope you can use this.
Cause I don't give a rats about who took second or 12th for that matter your just the next loser in a long line of many losers.
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August 12th 2005 at 10:29 AM
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Frosty
Junior Member
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464 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 11th 2004
Location: Michigan, USA
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If you don't have the plug that's no problem. Any piece of wire will work. Just unplug the connector for the kill switch wiring harness. Follow the wires that comes out of the throttle block down the handlebars until you find the plug. Then unplug it and just plug a piece of wire into the maiting connector. That will bypass the kill switch.
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August 14th 2005 at 4:36 AM
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voodoo
Average Member
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848 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 4th 2003
Location: Canada
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I use a 4 wire trailer connector. Just connect the white and the wire beside it (can't remember which it it off hand)
Then plug it in so it's jumpered the 2 connectors.
I’m gonna’ pollute my little piece of the planet so that future generations can’t use it.
Ontarians won't pay a penny more under a liberal government than they do right now under the conservatives. That's what counts. Fibby Mcfly
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August 23rd 2005 at 7:54 PM
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DaveTV
Starting Member
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36 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 25th 2004
Location: Braintree, MA
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I bypassed all the plugs and still no go. I took the advice of someone on another board(ARCTICCHAT.COM) and unplugged the plug coming out of the stator and jumped the brown to the black. They say if it ran then (with no lights or anything else) you have a prob with the safety switches or the key =- well STILL no spark, so I guess I can clude my prob is in the ignition system itself. Being it's 15 years old and has the original coil/CDI no huge surprise I guess - anyways this Clymers manual I have sucks, does not even have the electrical diagram for my sled and the troubleshooting procedures are too generic - I think what I need is an official Arctic Cat service manual for this sled..
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August 23rd 2005 at 9:04 PM
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arcticcatmatt
Spleen Splitter
arcticcatmatt leaving after work for 3 days of shotgun season back home!
Updated Friday at 12:16 PM
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14007 Posts
Group: Moderators
Member Since: November 25th 2001
Location: Berkshire, NY, USA
Current Sled: 96/97 ZRT 600
2008-2009 Miles: 450
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Quote Originally posted by arcticcatmatt
my bet is coil.. and being how old it is, a local used sled parts yard would probally let you borrow one to test it.. or sell it to you dirt dirt cheap
get er done and let us know how it goes! good luck
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August 23rd 2005 at 9:08 PM
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TriumphoverU
The Sled Guru - Moderator
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2192 Posts
Group: Moderators
Member Since: June 19th 2001
Location: Saint Johns, MI, USA
Current Sled: 2006 Polaris Fusion 700
2008-2009 Miles: 600
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Take a look behind the throttle and look for the micro switch to make sure it is working properly. If you had spark before swapping the cable out, I'm betting that is what the problem is. As far as i know, you NEED TO HAVE some slack in your cable, but the next thing that pops into my head is that the plugs you are using are totally fouled out and not able to fire. Try throwing a new set of plugs at it and see if you get any fire. good luck
Polaris is my way out - Other people just use a door.
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August 24th 2005 at 11:24 AM
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Frosty
Junior Member
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464 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 11th 2004
Location: Michigan, USA
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Dave,
Who ever told you to jump the brown and black is wrong. That ignition system is normally open. If you disconnect the plugs coming off the stator it should get spark without jumping the connector. If you jump it you are grounding it and that is the same as shutting off the key or depressing the kill switch. The engine will run with the plugs from the stator disconnected however if you get it to start it won't shut off with them disconnected.
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August 24th 2005 at 6:51 PM
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DaveTV
Starting Member
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36 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 25th 2004
Location: Braintree, MA
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Still no go - I guess it must be the CDI unit or the coil. 
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August 24th 2005 at 8:40 PM
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yamarx1
Average Member
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512 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: March 6th 2004
Location: toronto, ont, Canada
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Dave you should see a brown and black wire going to each carb. Follow them back to the double plug.You need to loop this doulble plug together to complete the circuit. The double plug has a male and female connector on eack side plug them together.Check for spark if none remove plug caps and hold about 1/4 above cylinder head check for spark. On Cats system if you unplug a switch kill/ key you HAVE to loop them or they dont work.Unlike most sled you can unplug a switch to over ride it.
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August 25th 2005 at 11:15 AM
[ Modified November 17th 2005 at 8:52 AM
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DaveTV
Starting Member
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36 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: November 25th 2004
Location: Braintree, MA
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I will give that a shot next time I give it a 'go - Thanks!
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August 25th 2005 at 1:00 PM
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yamarx1
Average Member
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512 Posts
Group: Members
Member Since: March 6th 2004
Location: toronto, ont, Canada
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Call your local A/C dealer and get the specs for the stator. Do you have an ohms meter? Also there should be a test for the coil which has a low and high side. Maybe ask how to isolate the engine from the wire harness first just incase you have a broken wire. This will remove all possible switches that might be faulty. You did the loop on the harness side ? not the carb side. Just checking.
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