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Formula 583's had about 102-103 hp, a little less than the Formulaz583 and later mxz583(about 108hp) because they were running with smaller 38mm carbs(i dont remember if the RV was also a little milder)
 

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yep, around 100 hp, but that is ski doo spec, it will be lower the higher you are from sea level and its not new any more.
The only true way to get HP rating is to put it on a dyno
 

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the 583 rave with 40mm carbs (formula z and MXZ 583 setup) was 102 hp stock.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
yeah it is the formula Z,there was a difference between the formula and the formula Z???????I understand it not being new anymore could lower the horsepower,especially having just over 8,000 miles.i may rebuild next year.but thanks for the info.
 

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Anyone know what the old 617's were rated at?. they were the same motors as the 583's cept they have nikasil bores and longer strokes, and im just guessing the porting matches the longer stroke. also i have 40mm carbs.
 

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Ummmm, are you pulling that number out of your A$$ teamNFG?

the bore is the same one 617's and 583's the heads are identical, and so are the pistons, so tell me what else can change displacement from 583 to 617........

and I OWN a 617 and yes they have cast aluminum cylinders (no duh) but they are nikasil plated instead of having a steel sleeve.

Plating is usually used on higher revving/ performing motors because it tranfers heat much more efficiently then steel and it is much much much harder and will withstand MUCH more beating, thats why all modern 2 and 4 stroke MOTOCROSS bikes run plated bores, because they are such high strung motors that run at 12000+ rpm, and are rebuilt frequently

I know for a fact that 617's were faster then 583's stock for stock, teamNFG please don't put information on this forum that you don't have any clue if its true or not. This forum is ment for people to learn things and to get there questions answered, you giving false info just makes the entire idea of a forum useless.

I asked a simple question, and if you dont know the answer, then dont post, plain and simple.

Im running a 136" paddle track (a slightly trimmed 2 inch), stock pipe and clutching and a 617 with 2400 miles, and ive consistantly taken 2 different mxz583 shorttracks on different occations from right off the start to about 80-85 then they start to creap on me. Both of the mxz's were stock.

So PLEASE, again, has anyone read anywhere or heard from anywhere what kind of numbers 617cc rotax's made?
 

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I guess the years of pulling wrenches at a doo dealer taught me nothing.
as far as hp #'s yes I am pulling them out of my ass, the only way to know is to run it on a dyno.
The stroke, you are right I stand corrected, the 617 had a different crank and HEAD than the 583
But Rotax did not run a NiCaSil cylinder until they dropped the RV, unless you have some whizy setup I've never seen
 

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Alright i looked closer into the plated bores and I stand corrected and I apologize for my mistake, it also has sleeves, but i was SURE i had read that the 617's had plated bores...

So team NFG, if you are sure they push around 80hp, why would a longer stroke and a diff. head drop 30hp.

is it rotary valve differences? are the heads that much different, to my understanding, the only difference to the heads were the cosmetics (ie: the machined bombardier symbol and color)

idk, I searched a bunch of forums and sites and googled it and i couldnt find a whole lot. I found one little clippet that said they make 109 hp but it didnt look like a very trustworthy site.

you know, i dont really care what ppl say they push, as long as when i have my clutching dialed in I can keep up decently in a drag with my buddy's 98xc600 wich is clutched, and I can take any 583 i run across, hey i guess they wont feel that good after i beat them with my longtracked 80hp sled.......
 

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ya I was just screwing with you
the 617 of coarse should be higher than the 583, and your 109 is probly what doo claimed.
but you need to remember that those numbers are at sea level, real life will be lower
If it runs great, who cares what it is
 

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how much horsepower is a 95 formula 583 with rave putting out??????
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I have seen 97hp at 7950rpms for the 583 posted many times on the net, 106-108hp for the 617, 112-114hp for the standard 670, I assume all rated at 7950rpms. They all used a 11.5cr. You have to remember some of these engines used different 34mm, 36mm, 38mm, 40mm, Carbs, some used single, some may have used Twin Pipes between models, all of which affects HP.

A std 670 with an R&D 618UL pipe, Dynoed 106.1hp at 7000rpms. Thats a Tuned Pipe for Plane use, no flat spots, smooth power curve!

RPM BRAKE FUEL FLOW/HR B.S.F.C. CORR.HP CORE TORQUE
3500 33.6 21 24.6 .85 26.5 39.7
4000 34 29 28.5 1.02 30.6 40.2
4500 47.2 44 44.5 .99 47.8 55.8
5000 53 46 55.5 .83 59.7 62.7
5200 54.2 46 59 .78 63.5 64.1
5400 54.5 46 61.6 .75 66.3 64.4
5600 54.4 46 63.8 .72 68.6 64.3
5800 54.8 48 66.6 .72 71.6 64.8
6000 55.2 49 69.4 .71 74.6 65.3
6200 58.6 52 76.1 .68 81.8 69.3
6400 62.5 51 83.8 .61 90.1 73.9
6600 65.3 51 90.3 .56 97 77.2
6800 67.8 52 96.6 .54 103.8 80.2
7000 67.3 52 98.7 .53 106.1 79.6
7200 60.3 90.9 97.8 71.3

670 Dyno Sheet
Rotax parts and service Ontario 912 582 ultralights

A Stock 583 with the same R&D 618UL Tuned Pipe for Plane use. Made 92.6hp at 7000rpms.
Rotax parts and service Ontario 912 582 ultralights
 

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I believe the older 580's (original Mach 1) were in the high 80's low 90's for HP. The numbers stated for the F Z's sounds about right.
 

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Anyone know what the old 617's were rated at?. they were the same motors as the 583's cept they have nikasil bores and longer strokes, and im just guessing the porting matches the longer stroke. also i have 40mm carbs.
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583s(76mm x 64mm) 580.9cc were rated 97hp at 7750rpms, the 617s(76mm x 68mm) 617.2cc were rated 106hp. I have never heard of a Skidoo 521 to 670 with Nikasil Bores from the 90's. It must have been a special Mod! Some did come with different size Carbs.
 
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