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hey I was just surfing alot of sites and came up with this site from Montana ( billingsgazette.com ) and here cut and paste sorry its long but read this!!! this is Eco-Nazis!!!! damn them!!

New snowmobile emissions in doubt
By MIKE STARK
Gazette Wyoming Bureau

With a new era of snowmobiling in Yellowstone National Park set to begin this winter, there are still no clear answers about which machines will be allowed and which won't.

Although testing data for several 2004 models indicate that some of the new machines will create too much pollution for Yellowstone, some snowmobiles will make the cut, a snowmobile industry official said Thursday.

"Absolutely there will be machines to meet the Yellowstone standards," said Ed Klim, president of the International Snowmobile Manufacturers Association.


But conservationists point to an apparently larger picture -- seen in industry-based testing data provided to the Environmental Protection Agency -- showing that some 2004 models are more polluting than 2002 machines.

In overturning a ban on the machines in Yellowstone, the Bush administration pinned its new policy on a new generation of snowmobiles touted as cleaner and quieter than past machines.

"I think that's unraveling," said Michael Scott, director of the Greater Yellowstone Coalition. "The assumption that the Park Service used that manufacturers would continue to produce cleaner and cleaner machines is an invalid assumption."

Noise and exhaust emissions have been at the center of the debate over whether to allow snowmobiles to continue operating in Yellowstone and Grand Teton national parks.

The Park Service decided in 2000 to ban snowmobiles in Yellowstone and Grand Teton out of concern for protecting wildlife, air quality and human health. Earlier this year, the agency signed a new rule to allow snowmobiles while acknowledging that the best option for wildlife, air quality and health was to keep the ban in place.

The decision has been praised by snowmobile advocates, who pour into the park by the thousands each winter, but was criticized by conservation groups and others who say it places environmental and human health at risk.

The new plan, set to start Dec. 17, will place a daily cap on the number of snowmobiles and will allow only machines that meet "best available technology" standards based on 2002 machines produced by Arctic Cat and Polaris.

But so far, there's no word on which snowmobiles will get the green light in Yellowstone.

"We're still working on that," said Marsha Karle, a park spokeswoman. "We might know more after this week."

As the snowmobile plan is put in final form, Yellowstone planners traveled to Washington, D.C., this week to meet with other government officials and representatives of Polaris.

A list of snowmobiles certified for Yellowstone is expected to be released in the coming weeks. Park officials are still trying to decide which testing method will be used in that process.

But in EPA testing data on 2004 models from Polaris and Arctic Cat, only one machine from Arctic Cat appears to meet standards for Yellowstone. Another snowmobile from Polaris meets the standard in one testing process, but falls short in another. A third machine, made by Arctic Cat, far exceeds the carbon monoxide standard for Yellowstone.

ISMA's Klim cautioned against putting much stock in the figures because those machines are probably not the ones targeted for Yellowstone. Like automobile manufacturers, snowmobile makers are producing different kinds of machines for different uses, he said.

"Some vehicles that manufacturers make are exceptionally clean and meet or exceed the new Yellowstone standards and will continue to do that," Klim said. "Others will be made that are not quite as clean. They're made for a different purpose and not intended to be applied in Yellowstone."

At first, probably only a small number of snowmobiles will be certified for Yellowstone, Klim said.

"But as time goes on, hopefully that number will broaden," he said.

Snowmobile makers will continue to develop engines that are quieter and less polluting, he said. But the market for snowmobiles outside Yellowstone will also call for increased power and performance, which could drive up emissions.

Klim said it's unclear how many manufacturers will produce machines designed for use in Yellowstone.

"I'm not sure how many they will need to build to have economies of scale," he said.

Jon Catton, a Bozeman-based conservationist who pushed for the snowmobile ban, said he hopes the machines mentioned in the EPA reports will not come to Yellowstone.

"Let's hope we can accept at face value what these companies are saying," he said. "If these machines are intended for Yellowstone, it's a broken promise to the public and to the Park Service."

Even if those specific machines aren't intended for Yellowstone, Catton said, he was disappointed to see 2004 snowmobiles that are, in some cases, 20 to 200 percent more polluting than 2002 models.

"It's not an issue of technology, it's an issue of will," Catton said. "They can say 'we're not going to use these machines in Yellowstone' but it doesn't change the fact that they're making machines dirtier than they were two years ago."

The Park Service's new plan for snowmobiles in the parks is open for public comment until Oct. 11.
 

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F-in lame, that's all there is to it! Also there is good article on this in the new Snotech, check it out...pretty interesting.
 

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Well I have a simple solution. Don't try riding in Yellowstone. They are gonna make like a pigeon and sh!t on snowmobilers no matter what we do. If all sleds were to run on water, have no emissions, leave no tracks or make no noise, they would still b!tch and complain about our sport. They chose one of the smaller industries to do this to because had they tried this with The Automakers of the world, GM and Ford and Honda and every other company would be down their throats in a matter of days, and it would all be over. Look at airplanes for example. I read that the average 747 or 757 uses as much fuel in one cross continental flight, as the average motorist uses in one YEAR. Why don't the EPA rag on them all the time? Because it is far too big of an industry to do it to.

There is no solution to the problem, no matter how well the manufacturers clean up their sleds, they will NEVER meet their standards. If they did, who else would the EPA waste their time bothering? No one else would let it go on as long as snowmobilers have...
 
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Yes,
This park thing is a bunch of Bull s**t. I live in Montana and have been through the Park several times. I don't know the numbers but I would guess around 500,000 people go through the park in a summer, maybe even more. Most of them driving motorhomes spewing out diesel soot. And talk about polution, think about all the sewage those people shoot out there asses all summer long while they smoke a cigarette and complain about the snowmobiles in the winter. I could go on forever about this deal.

Pisses me off too.

D
 

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Good points BigWilly, D Noel, the park makes far to much money off the half a million of tourist to try and keep them out..... BigWilly hit the nail on the head, were to small of an industry to defend ourselves like automobiles and motorhomes...
 

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I actually read an editorial about that in 2000 when it first happened. I was just paraphrasing what I could remember. I am surprised I could remember all that I did, because after winters of inhaling that horrid 2stroke exhaust that is apparently killing everything, I should have one brain cell left.

Don't forget that only snowmobile exhaust does this, the weedwackers the park workers use to trim those sites where the EPA are burning tires and smoking cigarettes, is really helping the air...
 

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i rode through yellowstone once and thought it was terrible, it was so boring, 2 lane highway and no off trail riding, i did read in a local paper from around yellowstone that only 4 strokes would be allowed, and i think thats all they really need, it is a "just go for a cruise" type of park neway...but i agree, they shouldnt be pickin on sleds...
 
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Your right, riding in the park sucks. But, what pisses me off is that they target one group. YOU AND ME. I believe, that they should just close the doors to the National Parks for eveyone. Preserve it from the public. That is what the so called environmentalist want. Kick every one out. Period. There are millions of miles of public forest service places to ride. I will never ride through the park again. That SOB living in Bozeman lives in a big house, drives an SUV, lives the good life while claming to be preserving the environment. That SOB otta be living in a TEE PEE, smoking buffalo dung, and leave us alone.

D
 

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LMAO, Thats hilarious, and its so true at the same time. Kinda like the bear hunting referendum in maine. Some guy sitting in his office in NYC says he doesnt like bear hunting and tries to end it. Damn Bastards.
 

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Yeh that is stupid they dont let u ride in parks, thev done it for how many yrs and have had no problems,why do they have to make a big deal of it now??
 

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CUZ WE ALL GONNA DIE, GLOBAL WARMING...AHHHHHHHHHHH
 

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global warming....isnt it suposed to be getting hotter? around here its been like 3 degrees cool this summer and has been getting cool over the last 3 years
 

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ya...i know...(R) wacky environmentalists, just like they say we only have oil for like 50 more years, when in reality we have oil for like 50,000 years but they wont let us drill for nemore cuz we are hurting the environment....
 

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Oh well, no big loss if you ask me, cause when I rode sleds through Yellowstone National Park i found it to be one of the most boring things that i had ever done. If they didn't have a speed limit and they would let you go off the trail i might consider going back.
 
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