Put the spring blocks on soft and set the scissors blocks to their lowest settings allowing more arm movement before coupling. Set the rear/rear as far back and lowest setting as possible.

 

when you say bucking is the suspension not moving and you are bouncing off or is it bottoming and bouncing you off or is throwing you off on the recoil? PPS is a soft set up and usually runs best with tight coupling. Was the pps left stock on the rebuild? How much sit in does the sled have?

 

Originally posted by jbshocks
[br]when you say bucking is the suspension not moving and you are bouncing off or is it bottoming and bouncing you off or is throwing you off on the recoil? PPS is a soft set up and usually runs best with tight coupling. Was the pps left stock on the rebuild? How much sit in does the sled have?

Suspension is moving....i don't believe it is bottoming though....i am not jumping or anything. I think it is that secondary bump/rebound effect. The shock was left stock and there is a good couple inches sag, and even more when i sit on it (flap pretty much at ground level).

 

Man oh man, i hope setup will change things greatly but right now i can't see this thing being a nice ride like some say they are. With the small bumps that are close together it just hits everyone and wacks you in the ass hard.....and it does not glide over anything.

Originally posted by myvertxcape
[br]Put the spring blocks on soft and set the scissors blocks to their lowest settings allowing more arm movement before coupling. Set the rear/rear as far back and lowest setting as possible.

I am confused, isn't that opposite? From the material i read i thought the blocks (at least the front anyway) were supposed to be close together to couple better and that it is the coupling that keeps the rails parallel to the ground to give a better ride (so you don't hit a bump twice??

 

Originally posted by myvertxcape
[br]Put the spring blocks on soft and set the scissors blocks to their lowest settings allowing more arm movement before coupling. Set the rear/rear as far back and lowest setting as possible.

doing this will make full weight transfer, and greatly reduces trial handling IMO.

 

It is all in preference, try the coupling blocks in different positions and come to your own conclusions. BTW, I never liked those PPS shocks from the beginning, clicker adjustables are the way to go.

 

if you have a couple inches of sit in without you and then a couple more when you sit on it, that is the trouble. This sled should sit topped out on hte rear suspension and sit in 1.5 inches when you get on it. There is a good chance the rear torsion springs are toast. You can take them off and measure the opening angle and see for yourself. If you end up replacing the springs you can change the spring size for your wieght. DO NOT use after market springs.

 

Originally posted by jbshocks
[br]if you have a couple inches of sit in without you and then a couple more when you sit on it, that is the trouble. This sled should sit topped out on hte rear suspension and sit in 1.5 inches when you get on it. There is a good chance the rear torsion springs are toast. You can take them off and measure the opening angle and see for yourself. If you end up replacing the springs you can change the spring size for your wieght. DO NOT use after market springs.

Supposedly these springs only have 600 miles on them (looked pretty good too). I have another set that supposedly has 1500 miles on them.

 

I'd say the shocks are bad. PPS shocks are not the best to start with and they do go bad quick. Might be worth a try to have the rear one rebuilt again.

 

shocks do not control the sit in. You can not look at a spring and tell if it is ok. You will need to measure the opening angle. Also are they OEM springs? If you do not get the sit in correct it will not ride right.

 

Originally posted by jbshocks
[br]shocks do not control the sit in. You can not look at a spring and tell if it is ok. You will need to measure the opening angle. Also are they OEM springs? If you do not get the sit in correct it will not ride right.

So what is the proper sit-in. SOmeone mentioned all the way to the top (no sit-in) and i have also heard a little bit is right??

I think something is really screwed now. When i came back from a long ride yesterday, the flap was dragging on the ground. When i got off and lifted it, it sunk a good 3"!

 

Originally posted by ludvic
[br]I'd say the shocks are bad. PPS shocks are not the best to start with and they do go bad quick. Might be worth a try to have the rear one rebuilt again.

Shocks were just rebuilt (everything replaced and recharged). So how come PPS aren't that great. I thought you were the one that added a PPS X-10 to an older sled (94 xcr??) and loved it?

Oh, and how are you supposed to turn those coupler blocks? Without unbolting them i can't seem to do it.

 

Eddie, Rails for pps xtra 10 suspension are required to run flatter. You are using steel skis which are higher lifting front of track off ground. You should get plastic skis or lower front torque arm mount. Fully coupling rear arm will force suspension to use front shock, set blocks on high for best ride. I would double check torsion springs to make sure they are correct ones.

 

I asked you what sit in you have in order to better tell you what is wrong. You decided not to check and say that you have heard different specs. This a real beef of mine. Do you want help or not with it. an extra 10 should sit topped out with no sit in with no rider. When you sit on it it should drop 1.5 inches at the back edge of the tunnel. As to turning the blocks. I always take the spring off the roller then turn it. I have snapped to many blocks by doing it loaded . If you do want to try to adjust them withoung lifting the springs up just remember go low to med to high, not low to high.

 

Originally posted by jbshocks
[br]I asked you what sit in you have in order to better tell you what is wrong. You decided not to check and say that you have heard different specs. This a real beef of mine. Do you want help or not with it. an extra 10 should sit topped out with no sit in with no rider. When you sit on it it should drop 1.5 inches at the back edge of the tunnel. As to turning the blocks. I always take the spring off the roller then turn it. I have snapped to many blocks by doing it loaded . If you do want to try to adjust them withoung lifting the springs up just remember go low to med to high, not low to high.

I did check. As i mentiooned above, there is a good couple of inches of sag (or sit-in) and even more when i sit on it. Sometimes it is different....when i came back from a ride on Friday the flap was dragging on the ground. I lifted up on the bumper and it just dropped straight down about maybe 3", and then there was some shock resistance. I figured it must be springs since they control ride height so yesterday i swapped them out for the heavy duty ones (as the fiance was going to go for a ride too on the seat jack). I started with the blocks on low and once she sat on too the thing literally sunk right to the ground (flap was actually stretched out almost flat on the ground). I then turned the blocks to high and it seemed ok when the two of us were just sitting on it but as soon as we got going and went over a couple very gentle bumps it sunk right to the bottom and the track was rubbing up under the tunnel on the tunnel protectors. With it the way it is right now (HD springs and on high) lift on the bumper and let go or push down lightly, it will go down about 1" very easy and then lots of resistance. In that 1" you can pretty much lift up and down on the bumper and basically bounce it as it feels like pretty much no resistance. With the 2 of us on it it sinks a small bit more but holds even if we bounce sitting there....it is just once you go and encounter bumps that it just collapses.

So something is seriously screwed. What do you think now?

 

when you put the suspension in, you did relocate all of the mounting holes didn't you? What did you use for mounting specs? Are you sure that the suspension is together properly? I am thinking that something is in the wrong holes. Can you post some clear pictures of the suspension?

 

I was thinking the samething jbshocks. the 92 wedge ran the 8 inch susp, and when upgradeing to the x-10, you need to relocate the rear mounting plate, and possible the front, but not in all cases. the mounting of the rear plate needs to be moved forward for the x-10, which should help it hold up and function the way you expect. if you ran the susp in the original mounting holes, the springs may now be shot, as they would have to have worked harder. you need to get them out and measure the open spread with no weight on them. not sure what the spec is though, sorry. if you do need to replace the springs, make sure to get original polaris springs. they cost alot more, but any after market spring is junk. do a search on here for mounting the x-10, been lotsa topics on this, and the measurements are in some of the postings. i also have a web page about doing it that i will see if i can dig up. now that said, an x-10 sled also has different spindle height, the front sits higher to compensate for the rear being higher. without haveing the higher spindles, your angle of attack for the track is off. you should try and find some spindles.

 

Originally posted by jbshocks
[br]when you put the suspension in, you did relocate all of the mounting holes didn't you? What did you use for mounting specs? Are you sure that the suspension is together properly? I am thinking that something is in the wrong holes. Can you post some clear pictures of the suspension?

Yes, mounting holes changed. The holes are 23 1/8" apart which is identical to a 99 xc Gen 2 that has the identical suspension (mine is from a 2000 xcsp). The height in the tunnel is exactly the same as many i measured (5.25" in the back and 4.5 in the front").

I am pretty sure it is together correctly. I kept looking at the pictures on the Polaris site when assembling to make sure i had the bolts/spacers etc in the right spots. Front shock is mounted on the bottom hole at the top of the torque arm and rear shock is mounted in the top hole in the rear torque arm (and torque rods mounted on the bottom hole).

When i first put it in the sled, it sat at the top of extension even after pushing it down like you say. It seems after riding it that it has started doing this and seems to be getting worse.

I always thought springs controlled the ride height but I have heard shocks can cause this.....i don't understand how though????

 

This is the best i can do for pics right now unfortunately.

[attachment=60803]
[attachment=60804]

 

Originally posted by shreddy
[br]I was thinking the samething jbshocks. the 92 wedge ran the 8 inch susp, and when upgradeing to the x-10, you need to relocate the rear mounting plate, and possible the front, but not in all cases. the mounting of the rear plate needs to be moved forward for the x-10, which should help it hold up and function the way you expect. if you ran the susp in the original mounting holes, the springs may now be shot, as they would have to have worked harder. you need to get them out and measure the open spread with no weight on them. not sure what the spec is though, sorry. if you do need to replace the springs, make sure to get original polaris springs. they cost alot more, but any after market spring is junk. do a search on here for mounting the x-10, been lotsa topics on this, and the measurements are in some of the postings. i also have a web page about doing it that i will see if i can dig up. now that said, an x-10 sled also has different spindle height, the front sits higher to compensate for the rear being higher. without haveing the higher spindles, your angle of attack for the track is off. you should try and find some spindles.

Thanks for the info. As mentioned though, mounting was changed and is correct.....i measured probably 15 times to make sure!

I would think i ruled out the rear torsion springs now since i put in others and same sort of thing (even the heavy duty ones). They are all true Polaris.

Yup, got new spindles from a 98 and actually have the extra 10 front end as well, so the front is jacked up too. The track is pretty much sitting flat on the ground right now. I do have to get rid of my 92 steel skis though as they have a higher rail profile that give close to an extra inch in height. So right now i have the preload on the front shocks turned down a bit to create a bit more sag to compensate.

 

Well took the suspension out today and tested the shocks. There is resistance on both and both pop back up, so they weren't getting stuck. Although when i compare them to the front IFS shocks they are easier to compress....well the PPS one is anyway, the coil is still on the front track shock. For some reason the front track one you hear some kind of scraping noise when coming up but it seems to move smoothly. When i push the torque arm down it does pop back up quite quickly though.....not sure if that is normal for fox shocks, but it does seem to be about the same as when i tested by hand after being rebuilt.

I had someone sit on the sled and then i pushed down......it is almost as if when it got to a certain point of compressing it suddenly got easier and then it just sunk right to the ground and stayed down there until the person got off (even after i let go if i recall). I also had someone else do that while i wathched and both shocks are compressing. This was even with the heavy duty springs in. Everythig seems to be assembled correctly....that half moon piece is in right, the front shock is to the bottom hole, the rear shock is to the top hole and the control rods are to the bottom hole and then attached to the shock at the front mount.

Oh, and the lower rear scissor arm is mounted in the middle hole in the rail....is that stock? There are no other markings on the rail so i assume it is.

So what do you guys think now?

 

Anyone? Thinking now, could the front track shock cause this collapsing if the preload on the spring were too low?